■ Broadcast: Ulsan CBS FM 100.3
■ Air date: September 23, 2022 5:05 ~ 5:30 pm
■ Host: Kim Yu-ri
■ Cast: Lee Dong-hoon, lawyer
■ Producer: Yuri Kim, Minju Seong
◇Kim Yuri> Hello, listeners. This is Sisa Factory 100.3 Kim Yuri. Today, I prepared ‘Lee Dong-hoon’s case notebook’, a key corner of the current affairs research institute. Today is the time for the last case notebook to talk with lawyer Lee Dong-hoon. In the meantime, the case diary reconstructed the major events that occurred in our community, and discussed their meaning and implications. Unfortunately, as the program was adjusted due to the reorganization this fall, the case notebook will have its last broadcast today. Today’s last broadcast of Lawyer Lee Dong-hoon’s case notebook, we’ll start right now. Attorney Lee Dong-hoon is now in the studio. hello.
◆Lee Dong-hoon> Hello.
◇Kim Yuri> What should I do because I am sorry?
◆Lee Dong-hoon> I feel like I was cut off.
◇Kim Yuri> Not at all. never. Yes?
◆Lee Dong-hoon> It wasn’t cut, but this is true.
◇Kim Yuri> Now, what should I do to meet Lee Dong-hoon?
◆Lee Dong-hoon> I will come down to Ulsan from time to time, but can I broadcast?
◇Kim Yuri> Do it every time. I’ll take you.
◆Lee Dong-hoon> Writing the script for this incident is also a job.
◇Kim Yuri> That’s right. I want to avoid it. But I must call you.
◆Lee Dong-hoon> I understand.
◇Kim Yuri> Then today is the broadcast of Lee Dong-hoon’s last case notebook. Could you tell us a little bit about your experiences in the past?
◆Lee Dong-hoon> I did a lot of effort to select local issues as much as possible, and to convey the legal meaning of the meaning and implications to the listeners as easily as possible. I don’t know if that intention was conveyed well.
◇Kim Yuri> Yes. It must have been delivered well.
◆Lee Dong-hoon> It must have been delivered well, right?
◇Kim Yuri> Yes, I think that you did a great job in making beautiful Ulsan.
◆Lee Dong-hoon> Yes, thank you.
◇Kim Yuri> So, what did you prepare for today’s notebook, the last case notebook?
◆Lee Dong-hoon> I saw that I was broadcasting on CBS in Ulsan for almost 5 years.
◇Kim Yuri> and long-term broadcasting.
◆Lee Dong-hoon> Yes, you said that it was not the last broadcast because of the last broadcast, but today I have two topics. One is the recent case of the body of a child in a New Zealand bag.
◇Kim Yuri> That’s right. This is really terrible.
◆Lee Dong-hoon> Yes, my mother was caught in Ulsan. In relation to this, I would like to summarize some of the parts that listeners may be curious about. Another issue is the stalking case in which a female station attendant was murdered in a bathroom at Sindang Station, which has become a hot topic recently.
◇Kim Yuri> Yes. You’ve come with these two recent incidents, but let’s start with the corpse of a child in a New Zealand bag. In this case, when the body was first discovered, many people were shocked. It is also known that his mother was caught in Ulsan. So let’s revisit this case.
◆Lee Dong-hoon> Yes, it was last month. The body of a child, aged 7 or 10, has been found in a suitcase sold at a warehouse auction in Auckland, New Zealand. According to New Zealand police, the deaths of these children are estimated to be between 3 and 4 years ago, or between 2017 and 2018. In the process, New Zealand police confirmed that the children’s biological mother left for Korea in 2018. So, through Interpol, we asked the Korean police to find out the whereabouts of the children’s birth mothers. Accordingly, the National Police Agency has been tracking the whereabouts of the children’s birth mothers last month based on their stay in Korea, medical records, and phone numbers. Recently, the Ulsan Jungbu Police Station received information about the children’s biological mothers. So, after checking the surrounding CCTV and undercover investigation, it is an apartment in Ulsan. Here, the mothers of the children in hiding were arrested. In the case of the mothers of these children, as you are well aware of the news, it is known that they also denied the charges, saying that they did not kill the children.
◇Kim Yu-ri> Your mother’s mother denied her crime. So, is it possible for a Korean investigative agency to investigate this? I think there are many listeners who are curious.
◆ Dong-Hoon Lee> Regarding the question of whether an investigation is possible in the Republic of Korea, the Korean criminal law uses territorialism as a principle and uses territorialism for Koreans abroad.
◇Kim Yu-ri> Beware of gullibility, please let me go.
◆Lee Dong-hoon> To put it simply, the Korean Criminal Code applies to crimes that occur within the territory of the Republic of Korea, regardless of whether they are Koreans or foreigners. And even if it is a crime that occurred in a foreign country, in the case of a crime by a Korean, the domestic law is applied to punish it. So, the explanation before is territorialism, and the explanation behind is gullibility.
◇Kim Yuri> Yes, I understand.
◆ Dong-Hoon Lee> In this context, the place where this incident occurred was New Zealand. First of all, territorialism does not apply. The mother of the children in this case is of Korean descent, but she is a New Zealander. So, ignorance doesn’t apply either.
◇Kim Yuri> Is that right?
◆Lee Dong-hoon> Yes, it is difficult to conduct an investigation in principle as punishment is impossible under the Korean criminal law. So, before the children’s birth mothers were arrested, it is known that the police in New Zealand considered how to cooperate with the Korean police, send a questionnaire to the Korean police for interrogation of those involved, conduct interrogation by video, or even send a police officer to Korea directly. there is.
◇Kim Yuri> It must be a very ambiguous case. Then, recently there has been a story that the children’s biological mothers have been subjected to ’emergency detention’. What is emergency detention? This is an unfamiliar expression, but please explain it to the listeners.
◆Lee Dong-hoon> In the case of emergency extradition detention, it is the same as issuing an arrest warrant because there is a fear of fleeing before the court judges the crime. In the case of Korea and New Zealand, an extradition treaty was signed around April 2002. In accordance with this, either Party is referred to as an extradition bill in case of urgency. Before presenting the request for extradition, the other party may request an emergency detention for the person for whom extradition is requested. So we can ask to get him arrested before we send the bill for delivery. Accordingly, the Ministry of Justice, which is the central agency for extradition, is the Ministry of Justice, and our central agency for extradition is the Ministry of Justice. So, I received a request from New Zealand for an emergency extradition arrest for the children’s birth mothers. When the Ministry of Justice made a judgment, it was judged that there was a good reason and ordered the Seoul High Prosecutor’s Office to detain an emergency extradition. Accordingly, the Seoul High Prosecutor’s Office applied for and received an emergency extradition arrest warrant and a search and seizure warrant for the child’s birth mother’s residence, that is, a shelter at the Seoul High Court. So, I searched and seized the residence. After that, in order for the New Zealand authorities to take over the birth mothers of the children, there is the extradition treaty I mentioned earlier. Under this treaty, a formal extradition request must be filed with the Ministry of Justice within the next 45 days. The Ministry of Justice will also decide whether to order the extradition review to the Seoul High Prosecutors’ Office after reviewing the New Zealand side’s claim. Afterwards, if the Minister of Justice orders an extradition review request, the Seoul High Prosecutor’s Office immediately requests the extradition review to the court, and the child’s birth mother goes through an extradition trial in Korea, and the final decision is whether to repatriate to New Zealand. complicated, right?
◇Kim Yuri> That’s right. Have the New Zealand authorities ever filed a claim for extradition to take over?
◆Lee Dong-hoon> I know that you haven’t done it yet. But if you anticipate it, you will.
◇Kim Yuri> Yes
◆Lee Dong-hoon> Something like this has happened in the past. Son Jung-woo, the operator of Welcome to Video, the world’s largest child sexual exploitation site, once received a court review in response to the US government’s request for extradition. However, there is a fact that the court did not allow extradition at that time. However, in the case of Mr. Son Jung-woo, the trial in a Korean court was still ongoing, and there was a special circumstance that he had Korean citizenship, so extradition was not allowed as an exception.
You can see it. This time, if the request comes in, it seems very likely that the court will allow the extradition.
◇Kim Yuri> Because I am a New Zealand citizen.
◆Lee Dong-hoon> Yes, it is the opinion of experts around that it seems highly likely.
◇Kim Yuri> That’s right. In the case of this case, there are also voices that the children’s birth mothers are foreigners who do not have a residence permit, so they may be forcibly deported. From what you’re talking about, it looks like it’s going to be an extradition process. Then the terms extradition and deportation are a little more confusing. Please explain this part. Are the two different?
◆Lee Dong-hoon> Extradition and deportation of criminals is a completely different system. The extradition process refers to the process of extradition or extradition of a criminal located in a foreign country for the purpose of conducting criminal proceedings such as investigation, trial, and execution of punishment, according to the request of the requesting country. As I said before, we have an extradition treaty between countries. Therefore, it can be viewed as a powerful criminal law procedure that determines whether to extradite criminals by force in the courts of the respective countries. However, in the case of forced deportation, there are cases in which foreigners in their country do not have the status of residence.
◇Kim Yuri> Illegal immigrants.
◆Lee Dong-hoon> Yes, that means that the visa has expired or that it is an administrative procedure for forcibly evicting foreigners outside their own territory. This is at the discretion of the country concerned. So, you may or may not be deported.
◇Kim Yuri> That’s right.
◆Lee Dong-hoon> In other words, it is a completely different system in terms of the purpose, procedure, and screening criteria for extradition and deportation. So in this case, it will be a deportation requirement. However, since it is related to a crime, it can be viewed as an extradition procedure at the request of the New Zealand authorities.
◇Kim Yuri> Yes, it has to be done through strong criminal justice procedures.
◆Lee Dong-hoon> Yes
◇Kim Yuri> I understand. Then we move on to another topic. This time, the murder case of a female station worker at Sindang Station. This case is also very shocking. This time, the personal information of the suspect has been revealed. First of all, can you briefly explain for those who do not know the case?
◆Lee Dong-hoon> Yes, on the 14th, in the women’s restroom at Sindang Station on Seoul Subway Line 2, a female station worker in her 20s can now talk about the suspect’s name on the air as personal information has been revealed.
◇Kim Yuri> Yes
◆Lee Dong-hoon> Yes, there was a murder case by Jeon Joo-hwan.
◇Kim Yuri> Is this a stalking crime?
◆Lee Dong-hoon> Yes, the case is now evaluated as revealing once again a gap in the stalking punishment law. It is known that the victim did not receive any safety measures except immediately after filing a complaint with the police for stalking. The police no longer wanted the victim. Therefore, it is explained that emergency and interim measures, as well as smart watch payment or linked patrol, were not applied because the victim did not want it.
◇Kim Yuri> That’s right. Stalking crimes continue to rise, and in Ulsan, the number of reported cases more than tripled in just one month from the enforcement of the Stalking Punishment Act on October 21 last year. According to statistics, a total of 124 reports were received by the first half of this year. Stalking crimes and punishment laws that continue to increase like this have also come out, so why are they repeated?
◆Lee Dong-hoon> First of all, the Stalking Punishment Act came into effect last year. It can be pointed out that the system has not been established. Before the Stalking Punishment Act came into effect in October of last year, stalking was a case that could be solved with a fine of 80,000 won. So, there may be an aspect that the perception that stalking is a crime has not taken root in society since the system was recently implemented.
◇Kim Yuri> That’s right.
◆Lee Dong-hoon> And another social factor that I think is important, stalking is not done by other people or people I don’t know. I think you’re overlooking the fact that most of the cases are from people you’ve been in a relationship with. In the end, even if you don’t want this kind of relationship, you contact and visit them, and there are stories about these methods of stalking perpetrators. “If you don’t, I’ll kill you”.
◇Kim Yuri> Is this what the perpetrator is saying?
◆Lee Dong-hoon> Yes, there is a problem that leads to “I will inform everyone around you of this situation”.
◇Kim Yuri> That’s right. So, I want to hide it because all this is rumored and uncomfortable.
◆Lee Dong-hoon> That’s right.
◇Kim Yu-ri> In relation to the repeated stalking crimes, the voice of the abolition of the ‘anti-indictment crime’ is very high. Is there no fundamental solution to this?
◆Lee Dong-hoon> As the announcer said, there are many things that need to be systematically improved in order to fundamentally solve the stalking crime.
◇Kim Yuri> What should I do first?
◆Lee Dong-hoon> First of all, there are abolition of the anti-intentional punishment clause, arrest investigation of stalking offenders, active enforcement of access ban measures, and attracting custodians to the detention center. In particular, the anti-intentional punishment clause stipulated in Article 18(3) of the Stalking Punishment Act should be the first to be addressed.
◇Kim Yuri> How can I change it?
◆Lee Dong-hoon> As I said before, on this issue, we continued to push for an agreement. It is known that Joo-Hwan Jeon said, “I can’t reach an agreement, so I ruined my life because of you.” What is the first thing the perpetrator does when sued?
◇Kim Yuri> I will go to the victim and make an ejaculation. Save me, tell me you don’t want punishment.
◆Lee Dong-hoon> That’s right. But stalking itself is an act you don’t want, but it’s an act not to come. As if giving the perpetrator a direction to go to the victim, this crime of anti-intentional punishment has regulations.
◇Kim Yuri> That’s right.
◆Lee Dong-hoon> At that time, the Ministry of Justice enforced this crime of anti-intentional punishment. I wonder if this is because the stalking issue is not taken seriously.
◇Kim Yuri> That’s right. It should have been abolished sooner.
◆Lee Dong-hoon> It seems that the victim was a little complacency to the extent that if the victim personally strongly refused, the perpetrator could stop.
◇Kim Yuri> That’s right.
◆Lee Dong-hoon> And additionally, in the case of a stalking crime as the reason for the application and issuance of an arrest warrant, ‘Possibility of harm to the victim’
◇Kim Yuri> There is a risk of retaliation.
◆Lee Dong-hoon> It seems necessary to consider your concerns about retaliation. In particular, it is called Interim Measure No. 4. It’s been a month since the perpetrators were brought to the detention center, but it’s hardly used in practice.
◇Kim Yuri> Why is that again?
◆Lee Dong-hoon> I also conducted several stalking-related cases, but I recently saw for the first time a case where Provisional Action No. 4 was applied over the past year.
◇Kim Yuri> Is that right?
◆Lee Dong-hoon> If your arrest is not made, there is a very high possibility that the perpetrators will not feel the seriousness. Among the interim measures, there is a need to make more active use of custodial detention. In addition, if you violate the prohibition of access within 100m or emergency measures, you should consider criminal punishment.
◇Kim Yuri> But I understand that access within 100m is prohibited, but what about emergency measures?
◆Lee Dong-hoon> For example, if we now patrol the victim’s residence, or temporarily move the victim’s residence, or now prevent the offender from approaching, if we violate this and now approach the victim’s residence, the penalty is a fine of 10 million won or less It’s just a disposition. Now, there are cases where people risk their lives to commit murder. Would a fine of 10 million won shatter your will?
◇Kim Yuri> That’s right.
◆Lee Dong-hoon> In case of violation, criminal punishment should be imposed along with an emergency arrest. As for the current emergency measures, provisional measures 2 and 3 prohibit access and communication for one month. This can be extended twice by 2 months, up to a maximum of 6 months, but I think it should be considered to set this for a long period of time, such as 2 to 3 years.
◇Kim Yuri> That’s right. So, is it the state that provides emergency first aid? from the government. from the police.
◆Lee Dong-hoon> The police now accept the court’s judgment.
◇Kim Yuri> Yes, in the case of the stalking crime murder case at Shindang Station, the ‘second harm’ to the victim is a more problematic case. What do you think is needed to prevent secondary harm? Lawyer.
◆Lee Dong-hoon> As I said before, most of the cases of stalking crimes are carried out by the people around them. Most of the secondary perpetrators of stalking crimes occur when the victim’s age and address are mentioned. Therefore, it is necessary to actively inform that the secondary offense of stalking may be another offense such as defamation. In particular, the protection of victims is a problem. If you look at the current police protection measures, there are watches that can be reported in an emergency, such as smart watches. In addition, there are customized patrols at the victim’s residence, provision of temporary accommodation for victims, and connection to specialized protective facilities. If you look at this, the victim’s life is restricted or the victim has to move, etc. The victim is the victim.
◇Kim Yuri> That’s right. It’s really unfortunate that we’ve been harmed, but the damage continues to increase.
◆Lee Dong-hoon> Yes, I am being watched. I was harmed. So, I think it is necessary to change the target of monitoring to not only victims but also perpetrators. Especially in the United States, victims, perpetrators and police have GPS devices. If the distance between the perpetrator and the victim becomes close, a report will be sent to all three. And GDP, GPS. The cost of the GPS device is also required to be paid by the perpetrator.
◇Kim Yuri> Of course it is.
◆Lee Dong-hoon> That’s right. So, I think it would be good for Korea to consider this aspect as well.
◇Kim Yuri> Do you need to do it quickly?
◆Lee Dong-hoon> Yes, but the law has not yet been amended.
◇Kim Yuri> That’s right. However, in relation to this stalking crime, many victims are afraid of prejudice or stigma effects. So I know that there are many cases where they are reluctant to report, but what are some ways to induce these victims to actively report it?
◆Lee Dong-hoon> As you said, victims often take into account the stigma effect, so it is necessary to get rid of the practice of passive response such as “no damage has occurred yet” during the initial investigation by the police. And, as mentioned above, it is a common pattern for victims to report and then go to extremes, so it is very important for the investigation agency to give the victims a signal that the investigation agency can protect them with an active response. Also, I need to be aware that I can be punished at the same time I report it.
◇Kim Yuri> I can punish you as soon as I report it.
◆ Dong-Hoon Lee> Yes, so, as I said before, there are many cases where not only stalking crimes but also domestic violence cases have provisions for non-intentional punishment. If we go toward eliminating the crime of anti-intentional punishment itself, it is expected that more victims will report it.
◇Kim Yuri> That’s right. I think there will be many potential victims who cannot report right now. Well sir. I think I will have to end it here due to time constraints, but if there is one last thing I would like to say to our listeners, please just say one thing.
◆Lee Dong-hoon> When I came, I saw a little bit of the National Assembly legislative notice system. According to the National Assembly’s legislative notice system, on the 16th, a total of 12 lawmakers including Song Seok-jun, a member of the People’s Power, proposed a partial amendment to the Act on the Punishment of Stalking Crimes. It is a form of ‘losing cattle and fixing the barn’ that is repeated over and over again. It seems that the above amendment also includes tracking the location of stalking actors and deleting the crime of anti-intentional punishment.
◇Kim Yuri> It’s positive.
◆Lee Dong-hoon> Yes, since an issue has arisen right away, it feels like it was proposed in a hurry, but the bill is currently not being passed in the National Assembly. I hope the National Assembly will not stop there and pass the bill as quickly as possible. There was something I said again last time. In the last broadcast, I told you that bills related to kickboards are still pending.
◇Kim Yuri> I’ve seen it many times. I’ve seen two or three young guys riding kickboards at the crosswalk.
◆Lee Dong-hoon> Yes, I am a little concerned that the amendment to the law on punishment for stalking will be pending again.
◇Kim Yuri> Yes, I hope that this bill will be passed more actively while watching closely. Today is the last broadcast. I’m so sorry, but how do I end it like this?
◆Lee Dong-hoon> What would you do? This is how you end it. I’m finally thinking of escaping.
◇Kim Yuri> That’s right. It is difficult to escape from the room, but I would like to congratulate lawyer Lee Dong-hoon for doing it and say goodbye again. The last song was prepared for our lawyer.
◆Lee Dong-hoon> Thank you Ayu.
◇Kim Yu-ri> This is a song by Sung Si-kyung from ‘Hello, My Love’.
◆Lee Dong-hoon> Yes, thank you.
◇Kim Yuri> We will greet each other by playing the last song that all our broadcasting teams have prepared together. Until now, I was lawyer Lee Dong-hoon. I was Yuri Kim. thank you
◆Lee Dong-hoon> Thank you.